20G Turbo

[STAGEUP]

Re: 20G Turbo

This question is for "its just a six" since he knows his stuff pretty well.

I have a TD06H 20G turbo with the 14CM housing sitting in my garage in perfect shape . What all do I have to do to get the 60-1 wheel in there? And reduce spool time. I have a 2800 stall BTW. Thanks!

 

[killa66cam]

Re: 20G Turbo

This question is for "its just a six" since he knows his stuff pretty well.

I have a TD06H 20G turbo with the 14CM housing sitting in my garage in perfect shape . What all do I have to do to get the 60-1 wheel in there? And reduce spool time. I have a 2800 stall BTW. Thanks!

You can sell it to me, and you won't have to mess with putting a 60-1 wheel in it!!!

Cam

 

[It's just a six]

Re: 20G Turbo

This question is for "its just a six" since he knows his stuff pretty well.

I have a TD06H 20G turbo with the 14CM housing sitting in my garage in perfect shape . What all do I have to do to get the 60-1 wheel in there? And reduce spool time. I have a 2800 stall BTW. Thanks!

Here is the thread I made w/some pics of the compressor cover.
http://www.syty.net/forums/showthread.php?t=53545

I had to machine the back side of the 60-1 compressor wheel flat.
I believe they make compressor wheels flat & convex on the back side.
My 20G compressors back side was flat so I machined the 60-1 wheel I bought flat.

I had to machine the center hole bigger of the compressor wheel also.
That is it for the center cartridge.

I used a stock compressor cover modded to fit a billet round stock of aluminum.
With the billet 3X3 aluminum, I machined the compressor covers OD of the inlet the same diameter, just further down, then I machined the 3X3 piece aluminum .001-.0015 smaller hole than the compressor covers OD, for an (interference fit).
My friend told me he needed for me to grind open the area around the compressors inlet so he can reach in w/his tig welder, so I opened up the area w/a carbide cutter.

Then I heated up the 3X3 aluminum piece to about 200+ degrees F & quickly slid the 3X3 piece over the compressor cover.
I then sent the compressor cover to a Turbo specialist Deadbolt (not in business anymore?) to machine the compressor cover to fit the 60-1 wheel.

When they machined for the 60-1 wheel, they machined though the original aluminum section of the compressors inlet.

Adding a larger 60-1 wheel usually does not cause for the turbo to spool-up faster, but I will tell you this, it might be a hair slower to spool-up initially, but once it gets into boost it will boost faster than it does w/a 20G compressor wheel.

If you have a 2800 stall converter, I would think that is plenty for the turbo to spool up fast enough,,,, but if you are not satified with it now, you could ,A, buy a electronic boost controller, I use a AEM Tru boost controller, using the spring mode you can adjust just how fast the turbo will spool-up. Here is how to do such adjustements.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDzx2oW0cak&list=FLC47WILAMLZIhl7pE8DUelg&index=23&feature=plpp_video
I always recommend a stiffer wastegate actuator, I use a 15 psi actuator.

Swtiching to a stiffer wastgate actuator alone makes a big improvement on how fast the turbo will spool. The AEM TRU boost controller also makes for faster spooling also. Combine the two together really compliments eachother & together makes for a really fast spool-up of the turbo.

It's funny, when a friend & I are doing some dataloging, he is looking at the boost on the laptop & I am looking @ my boost gauge, he has told me I am launching @ 21 psi, I thought to myself huh, no way, am I really launching @ 21 psi?, I try another boost launch to verify, I see I am stalling to 2100 RPM, letting off the brake @ about 10 psi, but as soon as I let go of the brake pedal, I mash the throttle & it instanly goes to 21 psi, it really spools up that fast that my friend still thinks I am lauching @ 21 PSI.:rotf:
This is done with a 12 CM turbine housing.

Hope this helps.:tup:

 

[tnsyty]

Re: 20G Turbo

I have a TD06H 20G turbo with the 14CM housing sitting in my garage in perfect shape . What all do I have to do to get the 60-1 wheel in there? And reduce spool time. I have a 2800 stall BTW. Thanks!

I have the exact turbo in mine (without the 60-1) and it spools fine on 2800 stall.

 

[It's just a six]

Re: 20G Turbo

i know its an "lowbudget-ebay-kinugawa" Turbo, but is that maybe an opinion?
artikelnumber: 150730327474
and
artikelnumber: 270893199927

Both of those turbo do not have an internal wastegate, if that is a concern, it is not a direct replacement, you would need to use an external wastegate.

The smaller turbo is oil cooled only & the other has oil & water cooled center section.

The first turbo looks nicer to me, anti surge compressor cover, the compressor wheel is a bit bigger than a standard 60-1 wheel. But as I mentioned, it does not have an internal wastegate.
It also has what appears to be a 3" inlet, which will require a different hose or Cobra head to hook up to your air filter.

 

[STAGEUP]

Re: 20G Turbo

Thank you for the awesome info!!

I got one more question concerning my TD06H 20G w/ the 14cm housing. Will I have overboosting problems with the 14cm housing and no cat? Or do I still have to port the Wastegate to avoid boost spikes? Thank you again

 

[It's just a six]

Re: 20G Turbo

I would recommend opening up the wastegate hole & blend the sharp edge of the hole after it is opened up.

When doing this type of work, you need to know how to do it as to not port the hole too big.
It also requires removal of the wastegate valve in order to access to the wastegate hole.

I ported open a stock 12 CM Mitsubishi turbine housing wastegate & am currently running 26 psi of boost pressure. It controls the boost very well, also the AEM TRU boost controller has something to do w/it also.

 

[STAGEUP]

Re: 20G Turbo

I would recommend opening up the wastegate hole & blend the sharp edge of the hole after it is opened up.

When doing this type of work, you need to know how to do it as to not port the hole too big.
It also requires removal of the wastegate valve in order to access to the wastegate hole.

I ported open a stock 12 CM Mitsubishi turbine housing wastegate & am currently running 26 psi of boost pressure. It controls the boost very well, also the AEM TRU boost controller has something to do w/it also.

Would u recommend swapping the 14CM housing for the 12CM housing?

 

[Storm Warning]

Re: 20G Turbo

I run a 20G w/ 14cm exh housing. With unported L35 heads but otherwise stock engine & injectors (Ultimate/2800 stall/3" exh/no cat) I had boost spikes with the Ultimate set on T1-16. My Blitz boost controller showed it hitting 18.3 psi peak at one point, and I had it set @ 16 psi to match the T1-16 setting. This was with a stock 20G/14cm exh housing.

I then had the engine pulled and rebuilt with forged parts, align-honed the mains, ARP studs throughout, custom-ground cam, bowl-ported the L35s, etc, and a brand new 20G again with the 14cm exh housing. The turbo shop machined the W/G hole larger and installed a bigger puck, and did some porting work on the exhaust outlet for a little better flow. I now have rock-solid boost control and zero boost spike issues. Boring-out the W/G hole and installing a larger puck was the key for solid boost control.

 

[MAK]

Re: 20G Turbo

Sorry for popping a question in your post "Typhoon-Dennis". Maybe my question will help you as well. It seems this thread is on a roll so I wanted to keep it going. I am getting lost, again, with all of this talk about putting holes in wastegates. Just when I think I get it, BAM!

I currently have a mostly stock 93 TY, 255 Walbro FP, MSD ignition, 3" exhaust w/cat, 3 bar MS, Velosyty chip, RPM CAI. I sent a 20g/14cm Mitsubishi turbo off to get refurbished and it came with a wastegate (straight shaft). I also will be putting in a 2800 stall TC. This (hopefully) will get me where I want to be with it. With my modifications, should I be thinking about getting the wastegate ported as well?......:banghead:

 

[It's just a six]

Re: 20G Turbo

I currently have a mostly stock 93 TY, 255 Walbro FP, MSD ignition, 3" exhaust w/cat, 3 bar MS, Velosyty chip, RPM CAI. I sent a 20g/14cm Mitsubishi turbo off to get refurbished and it came with a wastegate (straight shaft). I also will be putting in a 2800 stall TC. This (hopefully) will get me where I want to be with it. With my modifications, should I be thinking about getting the wastegate ported as well?......:banghead:

Yes you should get the wastegate hole opened up/ported.
It will control the boost better & not have boost spikes.

IIRC, the 14 CM wastegate hole is a bit smaller than my 12 CM housing.

 

[It's just a six]

Re: 20G Turbo

Would u recommend swapping the 14CM housing for the 12CM housing?

Since, you have a 2800 stall, you really do not need a 12 CM housing, however, it you want the turbo to spool-up quicker, a 12 cm housing will do that,,, but you will choke up the exhaust flow somewhat & loose a bit of top end.

Also, w/a 12 CM housing it will not require as much throttle to get the turbo to spool up.

It depends on your goals.

Hope this helps & I did not confuse you, if I did, ask more questions.:tup:

 

[MAK]

Re: 20G Turbo

"14 CM wastegate hole is a bit smaller than my 12 CM housing"

Okay, you lost me. Could you please elaborate on this one? If anyone has pictures of this, please throw them in here. I have an external wastegate so are you possibly referring to the round hole blocked off on the turbo/housing itself?

I am still getting to know these turbos so go easy.....

Big ass V8's seem to be so much more user-friendly! It will click one of these days (turbos).

 

[It's just a six]

Re: 20G Turbo

Here is a turbine housing w/the plug removed to gain access the the wastegate flapper valve.

I assume you are thinking the wastegate is the external wastegate actuator w/a straight metal rod attached to the flapper/wastegate valve?

Here, are the arms you can see where the wastegate actuator attaches to the arm.

Pic of a turbo installed ,also I added a helper external spring.

With the helper spring installed, my base boost pressure is 19 psi. The stiffer than stock wastegate actuator, the base boost pressure is 15 psi.

 

[It's just a six]

Re: 20G Turbo

Here is a pic w/the wastegate valve removed, this is the hole you enlarge for better boost control & less boost spikes.

*NOTE* : when you open up the wastegate hole, your boost will most likely drop off because there is more area of pressure trying to force open the valve, you might need a stiffer wastegtae actuator or @ least add an external helper spring.

 

[MAK]

Re: 20G Turbo

You are awesome, Six. Yes, I was thinking it was that hole but I did not catch you saying you removed the welded on round piece. Makes much more sense now. I do know the "flapper arm" opens a valve in there but I did not know you could open it up without having problems with boost. Those helper springs are a whole new set of variables I know nothing about...:squint:

 

[Treymen]

Re: 20G Turbo

I got my truck down to 3800lbs. No AC, a2a, coil overs/tube arms, ABS, countless bolts/brackets, fiberglass hood, etc.. I think stock weight is 4070. It will be hard to lose weight on a Ty. Personally, with out a superb tune from someone who knows exactly what they are doing, I don't think you will run 11's. The guys that have gone 11's on the 20g turbo worked their ass off for it and knew exactly what needed to be done. When people say, "I want to run 11's, what should I do"? The 20g doesn't usually come up. I'll put it to you like this, if you did get it to run 11's, I doubt you could re-produce it on demand and if you could, you would definitely be at the end of the line as far as your potential, i.e., you will be totally maxed out.

"Down to 3800lbs", with all those parts taken off? Do you mean 2800lbs?

 

[BMFB]

Re: 20G Turbo

"Down to 3800lbs", with all those parts taken off? Do you mean 2800lbs?

oh no, if you want to get down to 2800, you have to be to the point where its barly a truck and your starting to take a hole saw to the 'less important parts' of the frame (ask me how I know)

Also, about 11's with a 20G, it can be done but he's right, its not that easy, I guess you could do it with a cam, converter, f pump, l35's, lots of tuning and lots of meth (I'm still running stock injectors somehow). ITs really not the best way to go, I did it for a super fast spool time so I could autox. I regret that decision somewhat knowing what I know about newer turbo's now, you can have the best of both worlds really for not that expencive.

 

[Throws]

Re: 20G Turbo

...Also, about 11's with a 20G, it can be done but he's right, its not that easy, I guess you could do it with a cam, converter, f pump, l35's, lots of tuning and lots of meth (I'm still running stock injectors somehow). ITs really not the best way to go, I did it for a super fast spool time so I could autox. I regret that decision somewhat knowing what I know about newer turbo's now, you can have the best of both worlds really for not that expencive.

So... What would you go with now?

-P

 

[Storm Warning]

Re: 20G Turbo

My 20G/14cm does not have any helper springs and the boost hits fast and hard with the 2800 stall. I have the stock WG actuator.