7-second Syclone...

[MadPSI]

Alright, I'm venting, but bear with me.

Where the hell are any really fast trucks out there? I hang out with all my Buick buddies and their 3.8L motors making 1500+ hp and keep wondering to myself why I know of no Sys or Tys that are "very fast". I have watched Gallina and Connelly and Kenny D. make pass after pass just haulin' ass for, like, 3-4 years now. It's a friggen recipe with them, all you need is money. If there are people with lots of money wiling to make a Buick fast then I'd think that someone who's loaded would want to do the same thing with one of these trucks. Or are there fast trucks that I don't know about... :-?

Open-checkbook recipe for making a fast Syclone:
- Buy a bowtie motor
- Take it to Duttweiler and have him work his magic, ask him to set it up for twin 72+ turbos... He'll also dyno tune it for you...
- Get a chassis built (optional)
- Either get a tranny and TCase that can handle the power or go RWD and get some wheelie-bars. Transbrake a must.
- Beef up driveline...
- Haul seious ass...

I know there is a bunch of little things I left out like a cage, licensing, yada yada yada, but why hasn't anyone done something like this yet? Is there something that I don't know about that I'm going to run into on during a buildup of this sort? I'm guessing the above build will cost roughly $55-60k excluding the price of the truck... I know people with a lot more in their Buicks than that.

Just relaying what I hear from the Buick guys all the time...

 

[warmpancakes]

because there 10,000 times more support for buicks and they are much easier to find to build

 

[MadPSI]

That shouldn't matter. Aside from the obvious difference that a Sy is a truck and a Buick is a car, you're still just doing a "basic" buildup. What kind of special support would be needed for someone who knows how to make a car fast? The TT Opel for example, he had no support, but he knew the Duttweiler powerplant would make damn near anything fast. With the money I could make a friggen Suzuki Swift run 7s...

 

[sytyguy]

For me it's not about just going fast. If I wanted just that, I'd get an easier car to go 7's with and not dick around with these 1.6/1.7 short times and this heavy AWD. But if I go 2WD in a SyTy to go 7's, I may as well buy an S10 and throw a top fuel motor in it, cause to me, AWD is part of what makes a SyTy what it is. There's just something about making a SyTy go 10's while still driving it on the street, retaining AWD, running a single turbo, and doing it all yourself. Anybody with a fat wallet can take a Regal, throw 50k into it, and go 7's, but it takes someone special to tune a relatively stock Syclone to the 11 second range.

I have a certain level of respect for anyone who can go single digits with a turbo V6 regardless of what it's in......but I have MUCH MORE respect for someone like Dig who goes 11's in a relatively stock truck or Waller/Gerber who go 10's with readily available pieces from vendors who support us. For 50k, I'd rather have four daily driven, 11 second SyTys than one track-use only, 7 second Buick. To each his own.

We may never catch the GNs as far as overall impact, but that is largely due to number of vehicles produced, support from major aftermarket vendors, amount of R&D put into vehicles over the years, etc.... But make no mistake, there are most definitely fast SyTys out there......you just need to redefine what fast is.

Hood

 

[myclone]

For me it's not about just going fast. If I wanted just that, I'd get an easier car to go 7's with and not dick around with these 1.6/1.7 short times and this heavy AWD. But if I go 2WD in a SyTy to go 7's, I may as well buy an S10 and throw a top fuel motor in it, cause to me, AWD is part of what makes a SyTy what it is. There's just something about making a SyTy go 10's while still driving it on the street, retaining AWD, running a single turbo, and doing it all yourself. Anybody with a fat wallet can take a Regal, throw 50k into it, and go 7's, but it takes someone special to tune a relatively stock Syclone to the 11 second range.

I have a certain level of respect for anyone who can go single digits with a turbo V6 regardless of what it's in......but I have MUCH MORE respect for someone like Dig who goes 11's in a relatively stock truck or Waller/Gerber who go 10's with readily available pieces from vendors who support us. For 50k, I'd rather have four daily driven, 11 second SyTys than one track-use only, 7 second Buick. To each his own.

We may never catch the GNs as far as overall impact, but that is largely due to number of vehicles produced, support from major aftermarket vendors, amount of R&D put into vehicles over the years, etc.... But make no mistake, there are most definitely fast SyTys out there......you just need to redefine what fast is.

Hood

Well said and agreed here.

 

[ed hess]

yep its all relative.

If i wanted a dragster i wold build or buy one.

FInd me a grand national or anything else for that matter that can do the following:

1 runs 11's
2 driven to work daily
3 pass emissions
4 drives thru the snow without a 2nd thought.

what you drive and build is all relative.

but the moment you change this to 2wd your are talking a completey different setup. THats why they have forums for trucks with this kinda setup..... go search for s10 or f150 or pickup and well crap whatever the guy said before me.

btw, who let this young wipersnapper in here to find why we do what we do anyway?

Heck anybody can be like the rest of em!

ed

 

[sy112]

I know for me part of it is the love I have had for these trucks since they were produced. You always hear of someone talking about a dream car of theirs. Well it just so happened that this truck was released when I was in high school and still drooling over cars I couldn't possibly afford. Not to mention at the time Ford was basically kicking the shit of of GM when it comes to affordable performance. Then comes along this little truck that was making articles where it would outrun exotic sports cars!!!!!!! The hook went in deep right from the get-go.

And like the guys said, these trucks are worth the investment purely based off the facts that whatever we run at the track we can basically reproduce on the streets. Show me a 7 sec GN do that!!!!!!

I would personally prefer a truck that would run mid low 11's on the street than something that is 7 sec at the track. Cause when track time is over I know that I can show my stuff to all the cars at the nearest stoplight and not be scared.

Then there is the "honor" of tuning these trucks and not just using someone else's reciepe. Almost every truck on this board is basically a showing of the driver. That is something that can't be measured in my book. Hell anyone can throw a bunch of money at a vehicle and make it fast, but to take the time and learn about those things yourself I think is what makes a racer and not just a driver who goes fast.

Just My Humble Opinion..........of course

 

[MadPSI]

Alright, first off I'm not a young whipper-snapper I've been around for years before this board started...

Secondly, I merely threw out the option of converting the truck to RWD. I agree that it's kind of a disgrace to the truck to change certain things. So I'll set a couple rules:

- AWD is a must
- Turbo 4.3L V6 is a must
- Cladding and overall outer appearance (barring safety stuff) is a must

Third, I am not asking everyone what they want in their trucks, I know plenty of Buick owners that want pristine daily drivers that run 11s and nothing more. What surprises me is that I haven't found anyone who hasn't just gone balls-out with a Syclone. I have heard rumors of very quick trucks and even talked to a guy who said his Ty was in the 8s, but never seen it.

Fourth, I don't want to hear the whole "Fastest truck using stock intercooler" or "fastest truck with stock internals" or "fastest truck with basic bolt-ons and tuning". The Buick guys do that and it drives me nuts. I can say that I have the fastest Intensa Blue Pearl Sy in the world, but it doesn't make me feel special.

People make "dragsters" out of Buicks because that was the image that came with the car. It was a Regal that was a drag-strip demon. Our trucks share not only the distinguished title of being kings of the strip but also share the whole GM turbo V6 idea. It seems only reasonable for someone to have similar motives as I do.

And yes I know many people that drive their 8 and 9-second Buicks to work... I'm not talking about a trailer queen, but a monster street-truck that you can drive to the track, swap tires, and run some serious numbers.

 

[Sy769]

You can make a fast Syclone but are you gonna butcher a truck to do it?

McCoy's truck was fast but I class it as a "used to be a Sy"

Once you start removing the stuff that made these trucks a SyTy to begin with you might as well buy a S10 and build your own recipe from the beginning.

Tony's truck is a excellent example of fast with class. Still a Sy all the way. AWD,AC,interior, I'd like to see more builds like that.

 

[FLSY2730]

I am sure there are some trucks out there right now getting built or already done you just dont know about, wasnt there a twin turbo sy built by mccoy that the guy lives in new york, something like 1200-1300hp?

I thought i heard of one in alabama or arkansas also that was going to be 1200-1400hp, not to hard by todays standards , just need money.

Get a stroked bowtie block, some bad ass alum. heads, custom sheetmetal intake, twin bb 72s, custom 3.5 downpipes, 160lb injectors, brian could tune those, the best pistons, rods, and supporting parts money can buy, and have someone like dutweiller put it together and dyno it. Maybe 1500hp????

I would think 1300hp in a awd sy should be capable of running high 8s, dont you??



There are a couple of awd skylines out in japan running high 8s -9.0s, they are right around 1000plus hp?


Someone will do it sooner or later.

 

[Buster]

Re: 7-second Syclone...

I hang out with all my Buick buddies and their 3.8L motors making 1500+ hp and keep wondering to myself why I know of no Sys or Tys that are "very fast".

There is no 1500hp 3.8L on this planet.

 

[MadPSI]

That isn't true. Gallina just ran 7.98 @ 167 on a 207ci motor with turbo restrictions. That's roughly 3.39 Liters producing ~1300 hp. And that's using relatively old technology. If you're talking about a stock block I can see where you're going, but Duttweiler has cranked out some destroked stage motors in the 3.8L range above 1500 hp...

 

[smeagol]

All the BIG hp Buick motors I have seen were 247's or so... never saw any small displacement ones.

Anyways, to keep AWD to shoot for single digits is insane IMO. Go look at any of the Skylines etc in that range. Driveline parts are disposable in those cars, and they are SCARY going down the track. I've seen way too many AWD single digit passes, where the car gets real squirrely at shifts and whatnot. Maybe that's chassis/tuning/driveline issues... but I think the power levels you are talking for that speed, then putting that power to the pavement, the added weight of AWD and so forth... it's a losing battle.

On the street... that's a different story

Also, FWIW, everytime i hear any comments abou the 4.3 regarding Duttweiler - he hates it.

Why not build a SBC turbo up, where there are 8 billion parts available, the crank design is a lot stronger, you automatically give yourself 2 more cylinders to get power from.

Just my worthless opinions....

 

[DynaGlide]

I recall reading somewhere online about a Sy that ran 7's, but it was almost entirely not the same beast it was rolling out of Pontiac... down to a fiberglass body. It wasn't even AWD any more.

 

[FLSY2730]

I recall reading somewhere online about a Sy that ran 7's, but it was almost entirely not the same beast it was rolling out of Pontiac... down to a fiberglass body. It wasn't even AWD any more.

Maybe in the 1/8 mile.




That one skyline in turbo mag. a few months back was in the toyko auto show and ran 8.99 and a 9.0 and was a show car as well. I would like to see a skyline run that number, why would it be any different than our sy running that fast with awd. Dont they weight about the same?

 

[ghettosled]

Going 7's in a syclone or typhoon would be simple. Write me a check for $150,000 and I will Guarentee it to run 7s (LOW 7's)

Well buy a Bickel Chassis, fit it with a carbon fiber s-10 body, strap on the cladding, sell you my current motor, and run a Lenco. Its actually not hard. Its only money.

Wont really be much of a syty anymore, but then again do you think those buicks are anything more then a cosmetic resemblence of what they used to be?

Getting a motor to make the power is easy. Getting it into a car that works down the track is another thing. You wont find many of these people willing to spend that kinda cash on something there really isnt a sanctioned class for(I mean shit, it's costs you money to come to the syty nationals and have the fastest thing there; at most buick events they atleast win money).

You'd be better off to start with a mustang, and put a 4.3 turbo motor in it. Atleast then you could race in some of the fastest street car stuff, NMCA etc. and be competitive while collecting purse money, sposnsorship and contingency.

 

[UNIsackV6]

Anyways, to keep AWD to shoot for single digits is insane IMO. Go look at any of the Skylines etc in that range. Driveline parts are disposable in those cars, and they are SCARY going down the track. I've seen way too many AWD single digit passes, where the car gets real squirrely at shifts and whatnot. Maybe that's chassis/tuning/driveline issues... but I think the power levels you are talking for that speed, then putting that power to the pavement, the added weight of AWD and so forth... it's a losing battle.

On the street... that's a different story

HEY!!!! Oh yeah I am insane :wink: Well I can vouch for the scarry part, heavy brick mobile moving at 125MPH + its definitely not like doin that fast in a car...I think our learning curve has developed a lot slower but thankfully it has picked up and I think you'll see some pretty impressive times considering the two ton weight and drain of AWD...I'll put it to you this way I've offered to let BG drive my truck and he wants nothing to do with it, probably for numerous reasons but still it is a monster to drive especially on the street...anyways keep your eyes open, go to the Nats you'll see some things you didn't think you'd see...

 

[MadPSI]

That's what I want to hear!!!

OddfireV6: I'd be happy to pilot that truck down the strip!

 

[oldgrinder]

Damn, I just want to see somewhere in the 12's. Just call me SLOW!!


Oldgrinder
Syclone#1430
GAST

 

[AXXE]

If anyone is interested, a friend of mine will be selling his unfinished
S-10/Syclone project. He builds race cars and this was his project. It is the cleanest truck I have ever seen. No expense has been spared. He has $40,000+ in parts invested. He wanted to run 9s with it and it has a bowtie motor with the best of everything in it. It needs an intake, I/C, DFI, and headers. I will put it in classifieds when I have some pictures up.