E85 people ENTER

[TYTILIDIE]

Re: E85 people ENTER

Mike, if you ever try to get a real nhra tech inspection done on your Ty you will see you will have major problems passing with the meth injection.....tank can not be in the engine compartment, if its in the vehicle it will need a rollover protection valve vented outside. Just one of the reasons I went e98.

Really? Is that regular tech or is that for class racing? I have never heard of anyone having issues with that. So I guess I am asking, is NHRA tech different than tech when you are doing time only?

 

[HighPerformanceTrucks]

Re: E85 people ENTER

Hell yea it is. I make about the same power on E85 as I did on c16 at less than a 1/3rd of the cost.

Not being sarcastic at all here but, do you guys think E85 is really worth it? I set my fuel system up to be able to run it on a mechanical level but to be honest, the more I look at it from a financial point of view, seems a LOT cheaper to just run pump and meth. I know the failure of a meth unit can cost you a motor but I do have a controller that pulls boost in that event. Other than reliability, what can you get out of E85 over pump and meth from a performance stand point?

 

[SY-1193]

Re: E85 people ENTER

Cost is definately the driving factor here. Even with the price increases it is still cheaper (at least so far) than race fuel. The cooling effect of the ethanol is also significant enough to consider it. Also you can run crazy timing and that means power!

A few of the drawbacks with ethanol is the water content and consitancy at the pump. Retailers mark their pumps with: "contains as much as 85% ethanol" or what ever percentage of ethanol you are purchasing. They aren't lying here: the fuel can be very inconsistant and newer cars have overcome this with monitoring that adjusts for the fuels inconsistancy. We do not have that feature so you may have to do a retune with each fillup. You can get around this by purchasing your fuel in the same place or buying it from containers to keep the consitancy a bit closer. Keep in mind that the fuel attracts water also and that alone can lead to inconsistancy in your tune.

I have talked to people at VP about making E85, E95, Ect... available and I get some crazy responses from them taking to different people. They state that it is too inconsitant and tell me just to run race fuel. I think they are threatened???

For anyone running Methanol in their Alky Injection Pumps make sure to heed the warning with your kit also. Methanol in percentages above 50% is very flammable and burns clear so you won't see the flames !!!

 

[qbnkiller]

Re: E85 people ENTER

E85 let's you run on "kill" without the meth. Even if it were the same price as 93, you still have to factor in the cost of the meth as well. Besides that, I was able to get 15:2mpg with my next-to-last engine build if I didn't lean on it too much.

Ethanol + turbo engines = goodness!

you also have a much wider tuning window than on pump gas. I have been on it for some time, and even if it were the same $ as 93-octane, I would run it. Period.

 

[Aeroking]

Re: E85 people ENTER

Finding it is the biggest problem in my area. In detroit you guys have alot of stations. Here, there are twice as many stations that have race gas at the pump than there are with E85 at the pump. If it costs me half a tank of E85 to drive to the gas station to fillup with E85, whats the point.

 

[JSM]

Re: E85 people ENTER

Nothing says you can't run 2 chips. Daily driving if you want pump gas flip that chip on. If you fill up with e85, swap to that tune.

 

[TYTILIDIE]

Re: E85 people ENTER

Too bad we can't incorporate the GM flex sensor in to Code59.

 

[The Devils Own Chariot]

Re: E85 people ENTER

Too bad we can't incorporate the GM flex sensor in to Code59.

I was thinking the same thing! I just never said it :tup:

In the Midwest E85 is plentiful. There are around 10 stations in my area selling it. I want E85 because I dont like tuning two different fuel delivery systems. I dont like that Im doubling my chances of failure with an injection system. I want to just fill up at the pump and go. Before I could not run much timing until the injection system kicked in. I didnt want to start spraying at 8 psi either. E85 is proven to be safe and proven to make great power.
Autocross clubs frown on injection systems. They may not even let you race. Alkyinjection is not street legal. Not that anyone cares. I also hate the thought of an engine fire I cant see.
Alkyworks fine, I just think E85 works better. Im having Nolan tune my build on E85 on his engine dyno. He knows what hes doing and what works. With a mild build, fueling and bigger turbo its no problem making 500hp. Its hard to get E85 to knock. It just keeps taking boost and timing. The fastest trucks on here are running it. Thats says something.

 

[SY-1193]

Re: E85 people ENTER

Nothing says you can't run 2 chips. Daily driving if you want pump gas flip that chip on. If you fill up with e85, swap to that tune.

The Ostrich 1.0 & 2.0 with TunerProRT allows you to store multiple .bins in banks and switch between them. Exactly what Jeff is talking about here. This feature does not work with the APU1 unfortunately. If you don't see the EMULATION BANK in TunerProRT look under: VIEW -> TOOLBARS and turn on EMULATION BANK to use the feature. It alows you to switch to a different .bin on the fly (in emulation mode while hooked to your laptop only) just like the old Ultimate Chips did. You could even make and load a security .bin to one of the banks.

Too bad we can't incorporate the GM flex sensor in to Code59.

Would be a very nice feature.

 

[e95 Ty]

Re: E85 people ENTER

Really? Is that regular tech or is that for class racing? I have never heard of anyone having issues with that. So I guess I am asking, is NHRA tech different than tech when you are doing time only?

That is for class racing and or street night if the track is strict, and my track has recently become very strict and follow nhra rules very closely.....

I also have a few files in my bs3, One of them is a pump gas tune, one is a street race e98 tune and one is a all out kill e98 tune for the track only....

 

[MIXEDBREED]

Re: E85 people ENTER

E85 let's you run on "kill" without the meth. Even if it were the same price as 93, you still have to factor in the cost of the meth as well. Besides that, I was able to get 15:2mpg with my next-to-last engine build if I didn't lean on it too much.

Ethanol + turbo engines = goodness!

you also have a much wider tuning window than on pump gas. I have been on it for some time, and even if it were the same $ as 93-octane, I would run it. Period.

I will have to hit you up about the e85 thing. I might try running it in my syclone. I have ran nitrous cars forever and it sucks when a noid goes out at the track ect and your just screwed which basically can happen with a alky kit if the alky pump goes out then your back to low boost/ reg octane. Also might need to talk to you about some cam specs on the low low lol.

 

[MIXEDBREED]

Re: E85 people ENTER

High octane, cooler burn, easier to find than race gas, engine runs cooler, cleaner burn, less emmisions, more power, higher boost ect....

Maybe where you live but in oklahoma and texas where football and racing is a part of life there are plenty of places to get race gas lol. We do have 5 or 6 stations with e85 in okc though. I might be switching to e85 just to keep detonation down.

 

[e95 Ty]

Re: E85 people ENTER

You guys wanting to just try e85, its not that simple. E85 will make more power and has much better detonation control, but you need more fuel to do it. You normally will have to build a fuel system specifically to run e85, stock pump, lines, injectors etc will not be big enough to run e85. You also need to make sure your fuel system is e85 compatible, most pumps, fuel lines and paper element filters dont hold up well to any type of alcohol.....

 

[Quickstop [UK]]

Re: E85 people ENTER

So what are the parts needed for this?

The stock fuel hanger has metal lines so they are the first limitation I see.... Unless you are welding a sump into the tank which seems to be necessary.

Then you have the pump - internal or external?

Lines - are the normal AN lines with rubber ok or do you need teflon?

FIlter - already mentioned, metal micron ones - specs?

AFPR - is there a special rubber required for the diaphragm or are there e85 ones? Or is it a different metering system?

What about the o-rings on the injectors? Does it mess with your oil?

If it's just gasoline with ethanol then presumably once it hits the cylinders, it's the same as alky and regular gasoline.

If you spill it on your engine/have leaks, how corrosive is it?

Basically, what is the shopping list for a stock truck to go to e85?

I wanted to go with LPG but that is a bit extreme I think. Do you have that in the US?

 

[MIXEDBREED]

Re: E85 people ENTER

You guys wanting to just try e85, its not that simple. E85 will make more power and has much better detonation control, but you need more fuel to do it. You normally will have to build a fuel system specifically to run e85, stock pump, lines, injectors etc will not be big enough to run e85. You also need to make sure your fuel system is e85 compatible, most pumps, fuel lines and paper element filters dont hold up well to any type of alcohol.....

Yah wasn't that pretty clear in earlier post lol.. Bigger injectors, pump lines stainless filter and a custom tune. Since i already have a e85 pump that works with both a1000 and fuel lines and a filter looks to be just needing a tune if I want to go e85. Was going to use 75# injectors for pump gas but will go 85# for the e85. :tup:

 

[Quickstop [UK]]

Re: E85 people ENTER

Nevermind, barely anyone sells it here and it's still $16 per gallon

 

[e95 Ty]

Re: E85 people ENTER

Yah wasn't that pretty clear in earlier post lol.. Bigger injectors, pump lines stainless filter and a custom tune. Since i already have a e85 pump that works with both a1000 and fuel lines and a filter looks to be just needing a tune if I want to go e85. Was going to use 75# injectors for pump gas but will go 85# for the e85. :tup:

Sorry if that was already mentioned, didnt see it, just trying to help out.....Not sure how much hp your looking to make, but if your looking to make more than 600hp at the crank, 85lb injectors may not be enough on e85, but I am no expert. To make 700 to 800hp Nolan had me go with 120s, some are running 160s. I also had to go with a bigger regulator that was matched to my pump.http://

 

[MIXEDBREED]

Re: E85 people ENTER

Sorry if that was already mentioned, didnt see it, just trying to help out.....Not sure how much hp your looking to make, but if your looking to make more than 600hp at the crank, 85lb injectors may not be enough on e85, but I am no expert. To make 700 to 800hp Nolan had me go with 120s, some are running 160s. I also had to go with a bigger regulator that was matched to my pump.http://

Dont think I need 700 to go 10's. My goals are simple 10's and thats it lol. If it only takes 450 or so then thats all i will need. If not then I will bump it up little by little.

 

[dgoodhue]

Re: E85 people ENTER

You need at least 500 hp at the crank to run a high 10's in a Syclone with really really good traction. More likely 550-600 hp range. I think you could get their with a 85# injector and E85, but I think it would be near the edge. If it was mw, I would probably go up an injector size,

Also, I think most people size E85 injector 30% larger, so 30% larger than 75# is 110.

 

[MIXEDBREED]

Re: E85 people ENTER

You need at least 500 hp at the crank to run a high 10's in a Syclone with really really good traction. More likely 550-600 hp range. I think you could get their with a 85# injector and E85, but I think it would be near the edge. If it was mw, I would probably go up an injector size,

Also, I think most people size E85 injector 30% larger, so 30% larger than 75# is 110.

Ya traction and a good launch go along way. My gto ran 10.8 on motor with 460 hp and weighed over 4k with me in the car. The syclone has pretty good susp- coil overs, caltracs and will have some sticky street tires. I have 3 diff converters in the garage to switch to to get a good launch rpm down the truck has a 3k stall right now. Plus some weight savings and should run ok granted the tune is good. I will call campbell and talk to them about the injectors to use will my turbo bullseye 66mm batmo.